How to Select Your Show Sheep: From the Basics to the Bells & Whistles

I'm going to say sissy
because that's the correct terminology.

But like sissy chested sissy Jordans
that just look at you

and I just am terrified
that if I have vertical pins

at home that they can just walk
right out and escape.

That's a big deal for me.

I'm not saying that they got to be,
you know, like big chested,

like maybe the goat boys like them,
but like,

those things got to be opened up
underneath.

And like, when they look at you like,
I want them to be like,

you don't want to see me in a dark alley.

That's where I'm at.

Welcome back to the line.

I'm Sam Silvers with Logan Newsome.

This is real talk for the show industry.

We're answering the questions
we get asked every day, providing our take

on what's going on in the industry.

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Yeah.

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Silver. Livestock.

Newsome livestock.

Be looking for our upcoming sales.

We got one actually this weekend.

806 live sale coming up.

So that's going to be a good one here
that Logan and his family is putting on.

Yeah,
we're we're right in the middle of it.

Obviously we're right
in the middle of sheep buying season.

Goat buying season.

You know in the throes of it here in Texas
we're, you know, kind of right.

Just just, you know, right
in the middle of it got everything going.

And so we've got to sell this weekend.

So you know as we kind of talked
and we kind of briefly talked last time

we were kind of hitting on,
you know, selection and what that looks

like, what that looks like
as far as picking one out for your kid.

So we're in the pen.

What's the one that hits you?

What's the thing that hits you,
like first glance?

What's the thing that really you

gravitate towards
whenever you're looking for that one for?

For the kids? Yeah.

So I thought about that on the way up here

at a 4.5 hour drive and tried to space out
as the kids were in the back seat.

You know, telling each other
how much they hate each other

and slapping and kicking and fighting.

So you tend to kind of zone out.

I'm sure you do that as a dad as well.
I don't know.

No, we I tell them usually
what we try to do when we're driving is

I tell them three things
that I'm I'm proud of them.

Okay,

maybe I need to start doing that.

So I was thinking about

this topic on the way up here,
and it's like

I just try to go back into my in my mind
and replay,

like when I was at your house on Tuesday
and we walked in to a sheep.

What?

Because it's kind of like
second nature to me at this point, right?

That's all trying to replay in my mind.

Like, what is the one thing
that the one thing that I look for first?

And, you know, typically there's

a, there's a group of lambs in there
that are kind of all bunched up together.

I think the, the one thing that I look for
is body shape,

maybe center body and forearm.

Those are the two first things

that I look at before I say, hey,
catch that one right there.

Whenever you walk into the pen, like,
are you one of those that like as

they come into the pen, you know,
maybe you're looking at somebody's house

and I've struggled with this a little bit,

being,
you know, in sales mode as a breeder.

And also like whenever I go to somebody's
house, like,

you like to watch them,
you know, run around, move around,

you know, sometimes maybe they kind of act
crazy, like you said, they all bunch up.

Would you rather watch those things move,

watch them for a little while,
and then tell whoever's in the pen

with you, whether it's the kids
or maybe the breeder?

Hey, catch this one, catch that one.

Or would you rather that breeder, maybe,
you know, hone in on

some of the ones that he likes

and just start showing them to you, and
then you're taking notes on your phone?

Yeah.

You know, I don't I don't think that
it really matters to me.

I think
whatever that breeder wants to do is fine.

If he wants to go in there
and start catching them, he or she,

and showing them, because

typically these things that we're looking
at are going to be in an online sell

more than likely now
or some sale of some sort.

So, you know, if they catch them
and they catch them in the order

they're going to put them in, it's kind of
neat to just go through them all and

start taking notes as they go, you know,
and I, I think you owe that to them.

Right. A little bit.

Because even if you don't like the sheep,
they're still proud of him.

And they've put a lot of time
effort into them.

So let them show them to you
and, you know, keep it, keep your comments

to yourself right on your phone,
you know, hey, that one sucks.

Whatever.

That's kind of how I feel about it.

Yeah, that's kind of how we are, you know,

and I and I always,
like I said, always kind of, you know,

I guess whenever

I'm showing sheep at the house
and we have customers that are looking,

I'll kind of wait for a little while and,
you know, I'll let them kind of,

you know, watch them walk around.

And then if they don't come out initially
and say, oh, hey, what's that one?

Catch that one, then
I'll just kind of start going through,

you know, maybe my routine, but I like it.

Also whenever I'm at someone's house
and I'm, you know, on the purchasing

side of it, those guys have been looking
at those sheep since they were in the jug.

Like, we're in there for a small window.

You're looking
you're trying to make notes on your phone.

You know, hopefully maybe you're going
to get a chance to see them again,

you know,
or go back through them or whatever.

But those guys have seen them
since they were in the jugs,

you know, from the time they did,
you know,

did tails on them and marked them
and you know, all the things

they've seen them for 50, 60,
70 days of their life.

They know what their moms are like.
I want their opinion.

I want to see kind of the ones
that they like.

And, you know, and that's one thing
that we talked about in the last episode,

you know, having those conversations
with those guys, having

those conversations with those breeders,
because those guys have now

if they're like me and I'm
sure you're probably the same way, like,

I'm very opinionated of some of them and
I'm probably a little more passionate of,

like, you know, certain ewes and certain
new lines or maybe certain books.

And I'm like, man,
I know that thing's going to feed.

I know there's going to be
some good stuff there,

even if he's the skinny little ratty
one or whatever that looks like.

But, I mean, it's one of those deals
that like having those conversations

with those guys
and seeing which ones they like.

And again, going back to our,
you know, that

second episode where we're talking about
what's your goal?

Where are you going?

Okay. You know,
let's talk about the elephant in the room.

Where are we at budget wise?

Like let's kind of get a handle
and let those guys maybe

guide you a little bit of, okay, you know,
I think the biggest thing that

we've probably tried to do the last week
while we've been showing the set

that we've got
that we're selling on Saturday,

that's one of the deeper sets that
I feel like we've put together personally.

And it can be a deal
if you're not fairly advanced

and kind of have a good idea
of what you're after,

it could be a little overwhelming
if you walk in there into that,

you know, a couple of those pens
and just like,

you know,

maybe aren't quite as advanced in your
selection, or maybe you're a newer family

and you're trying to learn and trying
to get through it, like all of a sudden

you're like, oh man, I've got 15
of these things wrote down.

Like, which 1 a.m. I going to buy?

And so I think that's where you can

kind of rely on that breeder of,
okay, hey, I started these, I liked these.

You set them up, things looked good.

I liked this about them.
I liked that about them.

If I'm going to San Antonio or I'm
going to Houston, which one do you like?

Maybe give me three numbers.

And that's what we try to always kind of
like work off of, you know.

Okay, hey, that's there's 3 or 4

of those there that I like for this show
or hey, there's 3 or 4 that I like.

Maybe within this particular budget
that I could see kind of being there.

And, you know, I always slide
a little sleeper in the deal whenever,

you know, I'm in I'm in sales mode
a little bit and I'm like, hey, I like lot

one, lot three, lot five.

But I really like a lot 11
if that thing stays undervalued,

like,
I could see that sheep feeding really well

and I could see him doing doing
well down the road.

And so, you know,

I guess just to kind of kick back
what we talked about,

you know, in that last episode
where we were talking about,

you know, having that dialog
with, with breeders and just kind of

having interaction and, you know,
getting a feel for where you need to be.

What he initially what do you
you know, I say that center body.

Sure.

That's probably
the first initial thing that I look for.

And I know we can go
a lot further in depth

and go down a rabbit hole
and talk about what those terms mean.

But I would challenge the audience
probably to to look up those terms

and get the descriptions for those.

But what does Logan Newsome look for
when when he walks into him?

What's the first thing
that catches your eye?

Yeah.

So I mean, I think that's, you know,

obviously two big, big indicators
that we're big on body shape and forearm.

You know, like I do think that forearm is
one of those things that personally

I feel like maybe has isn't focused on
quite as much as it, it should be.

You know, it probably still come
maybe a little bit old school.

And that's probably,
you know, judging team coaches

whenever we were eight,
nine, ten years old.

And they're talking about the indicators
of muscle, you know, long term.

And so arms still like a big deal
that I just probably naturally gravitate

towards body shapes big for us.

I think at the same time and, you know,
we talk and I had this conversation

with a guy earlier,
we were talking about Texas majors.

Those things got to be big hit
and they got to be big pinned.

And if they are not big hipped
and big pinned and just kind of

have that just look whenever
and it's it's such an easy thing to see.

It's one of those deals that it can't be
hid, you know, from a show or standpoint

or, you know,

it doesn't matter if they're propped up
or they're loose,

like when those things run by their
either big hipped or they're not.

And, you know, I think a lot of that
obviously can relate to,

you know, expansion up high and,
you know, just what kind of sheep that is.

Like, we don't find many of those things
that are, you know, big forearm,

big ribbed and big hips

that are, you know, frail,
featured and sissy jawed and all that.

I mean, those, those kind of things
a lot of times

will always go hand in hand.

So, you know, we talked last time
and like we show in Texas,

muscle still drives it
like those things have to have muscle.

These are market shows.

These are,
you know, things that we have to have,

you know, and really

like, you know, we can say in Texas
like that's true everywhere.

Like these are market shows.
These things have to be stout.

They have to have muscle.

And so, you know, once we kind of start
going past that and we start looking

at those things, you know, like you
said, forearm body shape, big pins.

Like you start kind of checking off
a few of those boxes of like,

hey, that one might be pretty good.
Let's catch him.

You know?

And I guess that's kind of where,
where we probably land.

And then and then that kind of, you know,
the unique part about those things

in my mind is those are all things
that you can see loose.

You can see those sheep, you can analyze
all of those those indicators,

even if you're in the pen by yourself,
even if you're at home watching, you know,

hey, this is my project.

And you know, that
judge said this about him or,

you know, do I think this is good
or do I think this is bad?

That's just reading the livestock.

You know, that's just some

some evaluation skills there
that, you know, you can kind of develop.

And those are all things
that you don't have to have,

you know, the kids setting them up or,

you know, the breeder or whatever
that looks like.

That's just things that like initially,

like when they're loose,
when they're running around,

when they first walk in the pen,
boom, boom, boom.

Those are the things that we're
we're going after.

What do you think the what's the one floor

that you can't put up with
in a, in a sheep or a goat.

What's what's the
what's the one thing that's like, I'm out.

Can't do it. It's done.

I don't I don't know that's going to
I mean that again.

You know we kind of talked about you know,

how how far down
a rabbit hole like do you want to go like,

I'm going to say sissy
because that's the correct terminology.

But like sissy chested sissy Jordan's
that just look at you.

And I just am terrified
that if I have vertical pens at home

that they can just walk right out
and escape, that's a big deal for me.

Like, I'm not saying that they got to be,
you know, like big chested,

like maybe the goat boys like them,
but like,

those things got to be opened up
underneath.

And like, when they look at you like,
I want them to be like,

you don't want to see me in a dark alley.

That's where I'm at.

Kind of remind you?

It's it's. It's it's like you.

Yeah. Yeah.

I mean,

you know, the vertical panel deal.

Like, I could see you slipping
through some from time to time.

Do some. Correct.

I think I think for me,

I don't know,
maybe it changes a little bit.

Right.

And I think it it to me it changes because
this industry changes so fast, so quick.

And then we have a different set of judges
and evaluators

every year
that are going to take different animals.

And, you know, probably my hot take is,
is don't always buy the sheep you like.

Sometimes you got to feed the sheep
to fit the judge.

So, you know, at the end of the spring
when you're sitting there

pissing and moaning because you got beat,
it's probably because you showed a sheep

you like.

You didn't take the sheep
that the judge likes.

And like that a lot.

And like, that is such a, you know,
it's such an easy thing to hedge.

But at the same time
it's like maybe the hardest thing

because if you have like a strong opinion
and if, you know,

especially
I would say the guys that are breeders,

you know, and maybe we consider
ourselves good at this,

like you've got a cond like, and
you probably raise the kind that you like.

So therefore in turn,
you want to show the con you like,

you know, all this stuff
and that's perfectly fine.

Like, I don't,

I don't I don't love looking at sheep
that maybe I don't particularly like,

but it's this game that we play and like,
we've got these guys, you know that that.

And I'm not saying they're right
and I'm not saying they're wrong.

Like, but we've got these guys

that they prioritize things
differently than what we do.

They might sit here for,

you know, these first couple of things
that we've talked about

and they're like, well,
those guys are dumbasses.

Like they don't know
what they're talking about.

That's cool.

Like I have no problem with that.

But if you kind of, you know, do some
do your homework

a little and you're educated on who it is,

or maybe you've showed to them,
that's always been the deal that I that

where I'm at on like guys that we show to
I don't care if they like the kind that I

that I've got,
I don't care if they don't like them.

And I really don't care that first time
if we win or lose,

I just want the next time we show to them
for there to be some consistency

with what they did the last time.

Because if I got beat the first time,
I'm going to take notes.

I'd be like, okay, so
and so liked them like this.

Maybe I don't necessarily agree with him
100%, but I saw what he was doing.

I understood it, okay, I'm
going to go home and like next time

we've got him at this show
or that show, I'm going to be ready.

And so that's the thing that, you know,
wrapping into that, you know, difference.

And you know, with that

with different evaluators
and like what you said like, yeah, you.

Take notes.

You know, I don't I don't do this.

But I still remember when I was a kid
and we would haul the that's

when LA was big and we were hauling
to, you know, 5060 jackpots a year.

And I still remember
my mom had a little like book.

Yeah.

She would write all the placings down
and she would write down

what the judges like didn't like.

And we had all that in a book. Yeah.

To watch. Absolutely.

So it's kind of neat.

So when we went to selecting stuff later
on, we kind of knew what to hall to.

Well, and I think the unique part
about today's world as compared

to what we were doing back then,
you know, we're talking, you know, late

90s, early 2000, like all you have to do
is jump on Facebook, YouTube,

you know, ringside,
like, I mean, a lot of these shows are,

you know, filmed and,
you know, products and rewatch it, like,

hear what those guys say, listen to them
like, hey, every time that Conor

Brew judges, man,
like he keeps saying these words like,

I need to figure out

what he's saying about that
because he's doing my county show or,

you know, Steve is doing this

like he keeps talking about this kind
that he likes, that he likes.

I mean, we have such a unique
disposal of tools available for, for where

we're at in today's,
you know, in today's game

as compared to like what you talked about,
you know, like,

all right,
we're gonna drive across the country.

We have to show this guy
we don't know what he really likes.

Like, have you ever heard of him?

I mean, how many times you heard that?

Have you heard of this guy? Like,
I don't have any idea who he is, you know?

And you go show it to him.

You're like, oh, he is good or he's bad
or, you know, whatever that looks like.

But yeah,
I mean, kind of do your homework.

I mean, and, and I knew that I was going
to bring this up at some point.

And it's challenging.

And I know there's probably going to be
some of my buddies that, you know, say

that I'm a little bit full of it,
but I've always tried whenever we jackpot

and those guys
and I know we're kind of going down the,

you know, the, the judge deal.

But I think it's important whenever we go
in jackpot and we show to these guys,

I don't care at all

what they're saying or how we place.

I just I just want to be like,

I want to see what our stock looks like
out in the ring and in a big ring.

I want to see what they look like,
and I want to see what they

what we can kind of go home with.

And then I also want to see, okay,
why he didn't like this one

or why he didn't like that one, or
maybe why he did like that one, you know.

And we got along very, very well that day.

But I don't necessarily care about
the placing like it's just a scrimmage.

Like we all,
you know, go to these jackpots

and like you want to win
and you want to be successful.

But like at the end of the day

you're just kind of a bunch of scrimmages
leading up to this one big game.

And so we've always tried
to like kind of push the results

away, you know, and focus more on, hey,
what did that thing look like?

How do I need to change some stuff
whenever I get home?

What can the kids do better?

Show in wise, like all the different,
you know, little things

and just be very objective with it
instead of leaving their kick in the

bucket like, man, that got put me third
and those two in front of me were awful.

And so we've always
kind of tried to do that like preseason.

Yeah like preseason

like and just kind of look at it
from that standpoint and be like, okay,

this is what I got to do.

I know that I'm showing down the road
and I know

kind of what I need to do
and how I need to make sure things,

you know, continue to evolve
and move forward this way.

But at the same time.

Hey, that guy kept saying that he didn't
like my sheep or my goat because of this.

I need to kind of file that away
and remember,

because the next time I showed to him,
I want to have one of those.

So we talked about, you know, obviously
getting too far on the judges.

We talked about initial selection. Right.

And we both agreed that center body
forearm is an initial call.

We look at we talked about something
that, you know, you had stated that

your one absolute turnoff is going to be,

you know, sissy chested and sissy John

knows
chest with to him something like that.

I think to me

it absolutely turned off to me
is, you know, hind legs.

Yeah.

I mean if he's got a terrible hind
leg on it,

I'm out and we can
look that in a million different ways.

But to me, if I'm looking at them behind
them and their hawks bow out, I'm out.

I'm done from that
that point forward so well.

And I think that obviously goes into
I shouldn't say maybe obviously.

But you know, something that we've
probably and we've probably all done it.

We've made that mistake like, oh,
maybe if I trim his feet or, you know,

maybe if I, you know, take him slow or,
you know, whatever that looks like.

It's one of those things structurally.

And that's why, you know, you listen
to livestock judging one on one.

And, you know, guys will preach structure
just so much like a feed bucket

and exercise program
doesn't change it, right.

You know, like it's
one of those deals like,

you know, sometimes like, hey, if I could,
you know, get a little extra

bark on that one, I can maybe make him
look a little wider than he is or,

hey, if I really, really treadmill,
I can make that one stifle,

you know, a little bubbly or,

and, you know, a little more shape or,
you know, whatever that looks like.

Hind leg structure floors

can't.

Change it.

And always say you can't polish a turd
and you can.

Fact I've never tried.

That's you know,
you can polish in stone to a high shine,

polish some stuff, maybe into a diamond,
but definitely.

Not a turd.

Okay, so we're in the we're in the
we're in the pen still.

We're, we're we're analyzing these things.

You know guys,

maybe maybe they've given us a chance
to watch them kind of move around

the big forearmed one
that's big center body, big flat hip.

We got him pulled out.

We got him pulled out and set up.

What are we looking at now? Now we set up.

What are we looking at now.

So I'm in I guess

maybe I'm a little, you know, prototypical
Texan, I guess maybe, you know,

kind of grew up in that era, maybe pop
a K just kind of beat it into my head.

Then things got a touch good.

Like if they don't touch,
good if they're not crispy, hard.

Shapely, I just and, you know, going

back to that deal, other guys can disagree
and that's perfectly fine.

But like,

we like those things to touch big and
we like them to touch shapely and firm.

And again,

you know, that's kind of going back
to some of those indicators of muscle.

Like we talked about that kind of being,
you know, still the focal point.

Like if they're big rolled up back,
if their edges are big,

if they're loins big,
like those things have muscle.

And, you know,

a lot of times the unique part is you can
you can see it even before you touch it.

You know, the ones that are
little butterfly backed and rolled up.

And then you touch them and they're like,
oh man, that one handles good.

Yeah.

So and I think to me
that, that me too because I always.

Kyle Smithwick said this one time
he said you know the backs.

The first thing that that judge
is going to evaluate.

I mean, obviously he's going to see him

walk in the ring,
but they're going to touch.

That's
how in 90% of our shows in Texas, right?

Sure, if you're going to get a pool,
it's going to be on the handle.

And that's when we're going to know
you're going to go through the scale,

and you're probably going to be in the top
end to make the sale. Yep.

Potentially make the sale. Yeah.

They've got to handle

they've got to have some one
edge shape to them that's big to me.

I love a big one edge. And she

but I'm with you on that handle.

Touch quality I think is really important.

Then I think that's
when you start sprinkling

in some of the other stuff, like,
you know, bled and died.

Is it is it short enough?

Is this chess good enough?

Is this rear flying good enough?

That's when you start
kind of throwing in those other things.

But you know, center body, forearm touch,
side view shape,

those are things that I'm going
to initially sought

to get that one to the top
before I start making a commit

of whether I want to,
to purchase this animal or not.

Yeah. And I think you said it. You know,
I think that's probably the biggest key.

Like as we talk about this, you know,
we kind of, you know, offer some sort of,

you know, educational tidbits
for people that,

you know, might be new or
or wanting to learn or get better or just,

you know, driving down the road
and have absolutely nothing else to do.

But if you think about it like it
is, like we've seen it

countless times and, you know,
like maybe the, you know, some of the

some of the Midwest shows
might vary in this just a little bit.

But you think about, like our Texas
major show scene

and you think about cell spots and kids
making the sale.

And at the end of the day, like, for

hell, I would say all of us, like,
that's still the goal.

Like,
you want to get pain on their back, right?

And yes,
you know, a judge when they walk in

80, walk in a class,
maybe he does pull five.

Well, there's still you know,
let's take Houston for instance.

There's still 13 sale spots.

You know,
that we're all fighting for. Right.

And so we stack those things in rear view.

And like you said,
they go to handling them.

And if those sayings are squishy or handle

like a nerve football

or they're this fight
like it's not going to matter.

Like it's not like they could have
the biggest, whitest legs, you know,

kid could do a killer good job showing
like a lot of different things.

But like they stack them in there
for a reason, like,

and they go to handle them.

And so you, you might have multiple flaws
with that sheet.

Maybe.

Maybe, you know, maybe he's a,
you know, a little chubby over his ribs,

maybe his necks a little short,
you know, maybe in motion.

His hip and hind leg
doesn't hinge and work the right way.

But if we'll stack those things in
and you get that good first, handle him

sometimes,
like you can kind of slip in there

and get you a cell spot

with one that you're just kind of like,
oh, glad we got that one dotted.

Like, because, you know,
I mean, we've all been there.

Like we all try to chase around
and buy the great ones.

And you know, we're all trying to find
the one that will win.

But like sometimes at the end of the day,
if we're being realistic,

you know, you kind of get out there
in some of those classes and you're like,

dude,
there was 15 in there that were good.

I'm just glad that I was 16
and I got a cell check.

You know, I remember talking to my crew
after Houston this year,

and I, we took a chance on some sheep
last year that we had bought

and put it into different people's hands
that were, you know, cooler looking.

The shallow were cooler
looking ones that run uphill

and get into that big room
somewhere like Houston.

I mean, get your teeth kicked in.

And I told my career where I said
we were never

not buying sheep again
that don't have muscle. Yep.

Yeah.

We're going to put that foremost
and up front because

like you said, at the worst
we come out of there with a sale slot.

Absolutely not winning.

But we're going to come out of there
with the sale slot and we can save face.

Absolutely. Yeah.

You know me, I've been on this golf
cake here, you know.

Yeah. We can get up, up and down.

42 years later right.

Look at you.

Oh my goodness.

You read that somewhere.

I did not read that.

Holy cow. Let's play
a lot of golf and that.

And that's the deal.

And I mean like we talk about it
like save face, but also for what we're,

you know, doing in the you know again,
we're probably going to, you know,

reference the Texas, you know, major show
seen a lot because it's obviously,

you know our bread and butter
but like save face get a cell check.

Right. You know like
I mean we're all in the same boat.

Like that helps.

That helps us play next year

like that lets us put the coins
in, you know, and let the game continue.

Now, we're not saying go out there
and find the ugliest pin that is

in there.

It's not what we're saying.

So some that are just too much. Yeah.

And with that being said, so like,
you know, like you said okay.

So we're you know, we've found this,
you know,

we found a handful of them,
maybe we've sorted them into a pin,

you know, and,
and I think as we kind of talk about that,

if you, if you go to people's house
and you know, you're looking

and maybe this doesn't necessarily work
great like in a, in a live sale situation,

but we try to do it
a lot like the way that our stuff set up.

I always tell people like, hey,

if you want to sort a few of these over
and look at them later amongst, you know,

kind of the ones you like, like it's
just sort and stock like, let's do it.

And so let's say that,
you know, we've got 6 or 8 of these things

that we've got sorted over there.
Big armed.

They're big bodied, they handle good.

We've set them up and they handle good.
And their pin bones are big.

Like they've checked
a lot of the boxes. Right?

I mean, kind of a pretty good one so far.

Okay. Bells and whistles. We've got them.

We've got them turned sideways.

And I. Think. Ship setting them up.
Where are we at?

I think the bells and whistles
is what separates us from

$3,500 sheet to a 15 or $20,000.

Would you agree with that?

I would agree, I would agree,
and I think that's what you know,

and I think, you know, not to deter
anyone, you know, from buying them

because I think,
I think there's two things that.

Yes, absolutely.

The, the high end pieces, the intangibles
that are hard to make, the,

the things that make that animal unique
and no different than, you know,

the things that make a painting unique or,
you know, a vintage book

or anything else.

Like there are things about each
particular one, you know,

that might set that one
apart from his contemporaries.

And that's where you know, that one
all of a sudden, you know, has more value.

Now that value is determined
by the market.

A lot of times, you know, guys bidding
online, guys buying in a lot of sale.

And I think we also have to, you know,
like kind of keep in the back of our mind

and remember like that
could also just be two guys that decided,

hey I want that one. Right?

I want that one bad.

Like I believe the term is pissing
contest.

Where two fools met.

Yep. There you go.

And you know, so like those two guys,
I mean, look across the aisle and say,

let's get it on.

And and,
you know, that might be the difference in,

you know, one bringing X amount
and bringing, you know, three x amount.

So but so we've got those things

you know, we've got
we've got them turned sideways.

What what are
if we're if we're going to hit on,

you know, 1 or 2 of those things or,
you know, maybe just doesn't have to,

you know, obviously limit it.

But bells and whistles, what are they.

Bells and whistles to me.

You know, this is a hot topic right now.

But they got enough fur on their legs.

And does that fur match their foot size?

Sure. I think that's key to right.

There's some furry ones out there
that are dime footed.

Yeah. Look like a baby deer.

Yeah I can't stand that.

But fur.

Sure.

I think
a chest, the shallowness of their chest.

You know, how far is that thing
shoved up in their sternum?

Shoved up in them?

And then probably,

you know,
probably they're coloring, right?

I hate to say that, too, but, you know,
if they've got all those things we just

talked about
and they're white featured on top of it,

that's probably going to set you apart,
right? Well, it is.

And you know, it's
not that it's a deal necessarily.

And I see this all the time online candy.

You can't eat shag
or you know like color shouldn't matter.

And I'm not arguing with that.

But at the end of the day,
we're also trying to separate ourselves.

80 sheep walk into the class
at San Antonio.

Houston.

Like, you got to think about the things
that are going to make you different, like

make that judge
actually just give you that extra,

like look to see all of those things
that we checked off.

Big arm, big body, you know,
big pin bones, like all that stuff.

And like I find it a little bit comical.

And honestly,
I think it just doesn't make any sense.

Like those judges aren't
sorting them on leg hair or fuzz,

but it might have been something
that like gravitate towards.

And it does.

It gives them like a good look, like
they stand out, you know, green shavings

at Houston, bright lights, and you got one
that's just snow white colored.

Like they're going to pop,
like they're going to look.

And so it might just be a deal
that makes them look, you know,

hey, I need to I need to look at that
thing is pretty cool.

Looks good moving around,
whatever the case may be.

And so it's not a I guarantee if you
if you we took a panel and we, you know,

we pulled the best 100 evaluators
and we stuck them all in a room.

Hey, where do you prioritize leg hair?

None of them are even going to have it on.

It's just a, you know, it's just a thing
that kind of is a part of our deal

right now. And it's just something
that might kind of give you, you know.

It's an indicator. Indicator. Yeah.

To me, it's an indicator that that
that animal has been properly cared for.

Sure. Absolutely agree with that 1,000%.

You know, they polished the chrome on this

before they went to the car show
that they've taken the time, the effort.

It's there.
Yeah. That's just an indicator.

Yeah absolutely.

And it is it's it's something that

you know I think without question
I mean we've all seen it.

We've all spent

the time, you know, you know doing legs
or you know, whatever that looks like.

But yeah, it you see that kid out there
that you know, their leg

is big and pretty and groomed
well and it's like, hey,

that kid's probably been busting his tail,
like making that all look good.

Like, you know.

And I think we're to the point now
to that, that

the really obnoxiously haired ones.

Yeah. There.

No, no, it's almost too much.

But the ones you see,
that's nice. It's fit.

It's been trimmed.

Cleaned up good. Looks good. Well.

And where the industry is at from
a, you know, from

especially I mean
and I know we're obviously talking.

Well hey let's be honest.

Like the goat world's
kind of following the same deal that,

you know, we probably did 5 or 6 years ago
in the sheep.

You know, as far as some of those things,
breeders, you know,

maybe paying a little more attention
and some of those things,

you know, being a little hairy
or legged or, or whatever.

But I think if you sit back and like,

especially in the sheep side,
everybody's made them fuzzy.

It's just kind of a wash right now,
you know,

like on the good ones, like they're all
like their Hampshire influence,

especially if it's tended
to, well, long term.

Now we have them and, you know, they're,
they're, you know, scattered everywhere.

I know every breeder has them like, hey,
that one's not real fuzzy right

now, but like, hey, he's out of this
and this and this.

Like, there's plenty of
they're going to get fuzzy, like, go home,

take care of it, rinse and blow legs,
spend some time on it.

And so it just becomes a hey, as long as
you tend to it, it's going to be fun.

I think it's in a little bit
environment driven.

I take that into account
when I'm selecting, like

if I'm at my place
in Texas or years in the Panhandle or

nests right up the road kind of in between
us, right?

Let's just say, let's just say the western
half of Texas, right?

And we look at those baby lambs,
they're probably not going to be

as fuzzy as babies
as the ones you look at in the Iowa.

Sure. Yeah.

Yeah. But I still don't question it.

You know, I've had people come to my house
and they go,

I think that thing's going to be hairy
enough.

Well,
hell yeah, he's going to be hairy enough.

Yeah,
absolutely. It's where we live, right.

Well, it's the same way, like I'm sure.

And at some point
I know we'll probably have, like,

you know, somebody
that's a little more like,

show cattle, you know, world
like those guys would probably, you know,

are probably like, kind of giggling
at this, like the calves that come out

of, you know, off
some ranch in South Dakota,

you know, versus the ones that come out
of some place in Abilene.

You know, it's probably like, yeah,
there's going to be a little difference

until but then they all show up,
they all show it before it were.

And it's like Darrell Harry.

So okay.

So yeah, we kind of went on that spill.

And I know that's obviously a topic
that we're going to continue and hit on.

You know, maybe it's
kind of been a little bit of a hot topic.

Said anything

that we're actually shooting this podcast
and Hallowed Grounds right now.

We are we are.

I actually sent a Snapchat out
when I walked in.

And like, I don't actually know.

I know this is a boardroom,
but like all these books around,

like immediately, as soon as I walked
in, like, I felt a little smarter.

Yeah. Like.

We're shooting this at the home
of champions, Texas Tech University.

That's right.

Yep, yep. Big big big shout.

Yeah. Big shout out to the Red Raiders

I guess

Doctor Sam Jackson kind of
got us the hook up in here.

Yeah.

I told somebody Wendy Scott was up here
and she kind of helped us

hook some of this stuff up.

And I said, I don't know many ag colleges
in the US where you can just walk in,

walk up,
peak your head in as they're setting it.

Doctor Jackson in several other setting,
having a board meeting.

And I said.

I believe they were interviewing
applicants when you actually.

And I said, yeah, hey,
you boys have an important meeting.

And they said, yeah,
but they said, we'll. Be done.

Kindly leaves her.

More than welcome to have this
when we're done.

So cool. Cool to be back. Both tech grads.

Yeah that that was a
that was a very like whenever

we had the opportunity to do this
and we're going to hopefully,

you know, have a chance
to do some other stuff around Lubbock.

But like just to
I guess have, you know, them willing to.

Yeah.

I mean, we're obviously
just kind of getting started in this

and it's like,
oh yeah, you want to do that? Yeah.

Oh, here's the boardroom
that we do everything in okay.

So gut instinct versus checklist thinking
yeah.

Hang on I want to hit on one thing
because we talked about this.

And I think this can sometimes be a little
bit harder maybe for folks that aren't

I'm going to

use the term advanced,
but let's just say experienced chest.

You hit on that while ago
we talked about the bells and whistles.

Okay.

Chest, rear flying, chest to flank ratio,
whatever you want to call it,

that silhouette that those animals
can give us from the side.

Tell me why you think that matters.

And where it kind of lands,
as far as you know.

Is that the difference in you being first
or third, or is it just like, you know,

kind of like the leg we'll do like,
oh, hey, looks cool.

Yeah.

I think that to me that's what separates.

I don't know
if this may need to be edited.

That's what separates it
there between a trader sheep.

And a sheep that I'm probably going
to keep to try to win a major stock show.

Yeah. Honestly. Yeah.

Because I know if we've got the muscle

in the center body
and all those things, I'm going.

To get all those things that we checked
on. Yeah.

I'm going to get up there
probably in the top ten.

But that's what we're going to start

separating those things
I don't know, matter what evaluator it is.

You know the chest of flank ratio.

Right.

I think that's
what separates probably a nice sheet

to to a really good one.

Well he's a feed throughout the year too
right.

I think those type of sheep
are just easier to maintain and manage

throughout the year. Right.

I think that's absolutely
yeah I mean, I think it kind of goes back.

I think it can kind of be twofold there.

Those ones that are like and you know,

let's say the guys that are,
you know, raising stalkers and, you know,

real world stuff and,
you know, the Flint Hills of Nebraska

are not going to say, like,
chest doesn't matter.

And I would probably agree
with them in that scenario.

But like let's talk about flank
like because we talked about them

being big ribbed. Right.

So you know those ones that are like
big ribbed and swoopy bellied

like I mean soggy flanked
whatever you want to call it.

Like those are going to be practical.

Like so we're talking real world
and you know, show Showtime.

Those are going to be practical.

Like maybe a little easier fleshing
a little easier doing like maturity

could be a little better on them
instead of those ones that like

maybe like, well,
we kind of grew up showing like there's

actually a picture in your office
of like this blue one.

And man, that thing was like,

I bet he handled.

Really good.

I bet he I bet he handled incredible.

Oh, I bet it was so good.

But like, so we're talking about,
you know, chest and flank and like

I think the chest deal comes in to play

maybe more of a uniqueness.

Because I find myself
sometimes when I'm evaluating

if they are big, big center bodied

and by no means do I like them deep.

But like, sometimes,
maybe if they're proportional

and their underlying, you can be like,
hey, I'm going to let that one slide.

I know he's not as shallow and freaky
maybe up there in terms of his chest

and his sternum and all that.

But like, that thing's
rib cage is built like a 55 gallon drum.

So while we want them big ribbed
in order to put everything,

you know, stack everything up on top,
you know, it's kind of on those deals.

Like, I get it.

Especially if, like, now,
if the one that's sitting right there

and the one that we're

trying to make a call on is shallower
and still big, big rib too.

Okay. No brainer.

We're going to go with that one.

But if it's one of those deals
that maybe he's a little more closed off

and like he's shallow but like, hey,
that one's a little flatter

in terms of his for rib.

Like he offers us kind of that
real, real good two dimensional look,

but like he kind of step in behind him
or you step in that three quarter

like, man,
that one just ain't pulled apart enough.

That's whenever you know, the chest
deal to me has always kind of been like,

all right we got to pay attention to it.

But like, we can't get so lost
in making them shallow that we lose.

You know, maybe, maybe what
we're actually trying to chase as far.

As and I think too, with that,
with the soggy rear flank in them,

you know, you can feed probably
a massive amount of rear flank into them.

And that's going to give them

the appearance that they are shallower
chested.

Sure. Absolutely.

Absolutely. Hate to say it,
you can fool a lot of evaluators.

Absolutely.

Get on the mic and say,
oh, this thing is so shallow.

Yeah. No,
I just fed a really big rear flanking.

Yeah. He's he's swoopy belly.
That's really all he is. You drenched him.

You know he got seven guns as well
and seven guns of water

right before you walked in.

I mean, yeah, you can
you can change those things, you know.

And so yeah.

So that's so
but but definitely like going,

you know, kind of going back
to what we talked about

because again, we've checked, you know,

maybe 4 or 5 of those big, big indicators
we absolutely have to have.

And now we're kind of talking about,
you know, those things that are

you know, they're the bells and whistles.

They're the things that might highlight.

And they're the ones
that might make some things,

you know, stand out and, you know,
look different and, and all that.

So price pressure, can we talk about that?

Hang on.

We got to hit on one thing
because it's something that I think we

we see it in different stages
and we see it because we it

depends on who's evaluating
watching those sheep in motion.

Okay.

So we've talked
about what those things look like.

We've checked all the boxes.

We've found the ones
with the bells and whistles okay.

Where are you at on I know,
I know your hip and hind leg no doubt.

Got to be good.

Where are we at on those things
moving around the ring?

Kind of, you know, maybe some indicators
because we've kind of checked

the structural correctness box.

I feel like for what we've talked about,
you know, we talked about them

having to be, you know, wide and open up
square underneath hip and hind legs.

Got to be right.

So really from a structure standpoint
we're pretty good.

You know on this on this animal
we've kind of all built up in our mind.

And hopefully our listeners
are driving down the road, you know,

thinking, man, I'm going to go find me
one of those at Logan or Sam Sales.

But where
are we at on those things like moving?

You know, we get into that deal
where sometimes guys are like,

they get to the top five or let's,
let's say they get to the top ten.

All right, let's walk them.

And then they place one
and then they get to the top nine.

All right. Let's walk them.
And then they place one.

You know we continue to do it.

And they and you know they
they they just kind of one in time.

But we continue to walk
walk, walk. It's a little track meet.

And you get some guys that always say
they walked them in and walked them out.

Where, where, where do you land on that.

Where do you find. And I know we're in.

You know, it kind of goes
back to the evaluator, but like, where's

maybe some happy ground
that you can just kind of feel comfortable

with, like where we're sitting
right here today and you know, we know

who's judging one of our major stock
shows.

Yeah, I feel like that
I'll take the happy medium on that.

Right.

I obviously I want to watch them move
around the pin when I'm selecting them.

Do they do they hold their head
carriage up when you let them go?

You know,
I don't want that one that's dead.

And its head just kind of hangs there
like a limp noodle, you know,

as ears are down, as heads
down, blades come up above his chin.

That kind of deal, you know,
that's going to hinder me, so to speak.

Does he
kind of float around when you let him go?

You know, nothings just too like rigid or

joints aren't too rigid or nasty.

Does he hold his head carriage up
a little bit? Does he?

Does he kind of throw his head up
and look at you? I think that's important.

And I think it's really important
for those people listening in us to

with still young kids.
Absolutely huge deal.

You know, those short neck down
headed ones.

Our kids aren't going to be able to make
a move right in the ring and look enough.

And that's a lesson
that I've learned the hard way.

Absolutely.

And that's something we still struggle
with even in the Silver's household, is

we come home every time
and I say we don't leave good enough.

We're not leading good enough.
We got to lead better.

We got to lead better.

And I'm always harping on my kids
about that.

But at the same time I'm like,
you know, dad probably didn't do enough,

good enough job selecting the animal
there moves in good.

Moves in good and runs. Yeah.

And you know, tidbit there for listeners
that want to, you know,

if you'll follow Sam on Snapchat,
he's always got some unique ways

to make those sheep
walk down the road, the road there.

So feel free to,

you know, hit him up and see
if he can give you any insight on that.

Probably not something we can put on line.

Yeah, I'm kind of the same way. Like now.

I mean, I,
I want those things to move good.

We spent we were the same way.

Like we walk up and down the road,
you know when kids are practicing,

I tell them get in the yard
and it's usually get in the yard.

And then, you know, we walk down the road
and that's kind of how we spend our time,

you know, hand walking and whatever.

And you know, it always it always ends
with one of them fighting or crying.

I mean, that's just that's just how it is.

But like, it, it is it's what we do.

But like,
I think the biggest thing for me as far as

watching those things in motion again,

you know, we talked about it like I'm
going to study their hip and hind leg.

I'm also like,
you know, full time Shepherd.

Right?

So like I get to see those things
typically at home, whether we're sorting

ewes, looking at bugs,
watching the babies, kids are at school.

Like I kind of kind of evaluate a lot of
stuff, you know, like a good buddy.

You know, Robert
Ashley would always talk about

putting sitting on a bucket,
you know, and just watching the sheep.

And I think that's a
that's a good indicator

of like probably where I land,
whether it's whenever

I'm buying or whether I'm,
you know, evaluating a show.

Like I want to study some like things.

But I also just kind of
want to see what those things look like

naturally, like just
because all the same things kind of fit.

This thing's fit. Does it work?

Does it balance, you know, structurally,
is there spine flat?

You know, like that's that's probably I'm
probably not as big on oh my gosh.

They got to you know run up hill and
you know be geeky and you know all that.

And I'm not saying that's that's wrong.

But I'm more like
I want to see them things flat spine.

I don't want to see them handle their hip
and hind leg the way they're supposed to.

That's just
and I think if you do that, you can find

good middle ground
no matter who's judging.

Yeah, I can't wait to having that
on evaluators and evaluation.

Plenty of soap boxes there.

So now you've made those points.

Can we get to gut instinct versus
checklist thinking.

Yeah I got a theory. I've got my own.

So would you like me to.

Would you like me to think about it from a

buying perspective.

Or do you like to me to think about it
from an evaluation perspective.

By oh, okay.

Gut instinct.

Yeah.

I'm a bad gut instinct buyer.

Like they just.

And I'm probably a little bit like that
also as an evaluator,

man, when they freaking hit me,
they just hit me like.

And I'm just like, there's no going back.

And I know that, like, you know, I'm
probably just going to buy this thing

no matter what he costs.

And then I'm going to like, you know,

figure out if I got any copper wire
that I can sell at home or something.

You know, just
I mean, I'm just going all in.

I'm pushing the chips in,
and then it's like, you know,

sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

But I'm always happy, you know, right
up until the point that it doesn't work.

Genuinely thinking about this
and you on the way up here today to was

you know,
you're you're a, you're a swing big.

Oh this big hit big kind of guy. Right.

And I'm the guy that's like,
I'm going to go and I'm

going to try to milk something
out of something, right?

Like it may just be a reserve champion.

Southdown something.

I'm going to get me something
before I get out of here.

Yeah. I'm swinging for the fences.

I am definitely
that's definitely where I kind of land.

It's part of the reason we talked about it
last time.

Like it's part of the reason that I like,
I have to I can't give up on them.

Like, I just have to, like I'm committed.

Like I'm in that down there in that box
whole, like, I gotta, I gotta fight.

You gotta get out of here.

So I think I used to be
a gut instinct kind of guy, and I think

I still am to a point, but I hate to keep,
you know, beating a dead horse on this.

But as the prices of these things
have risen, sure,

I'm not as much a gut instinct guy,

because used to I would walk in
and I'd be like, yep, that's him.

Let's go.

Now it's like, yep, that's him.

Oh, how much is he? How much does it cost?

That's when we start
going through the checklist okay.

Like, you know,
I know if this thing is going to cost me

ten, 15, $20,000, like, stuff's going
to have to fit a little bit better, right?

Well, and I think that also, you know,
as we talk about this and, you know,

separating ourselves from the breeder,
the seller, you know, even,

you know, the the advisor

in some capacity to our customers,
whatever you want to call that.

And just think about it strictly
from like stock show dad standpoint.

It also the checklist becomes
more and more real to me

as we're sitting here again.

You know,
we talked about it like we don't know

who's doing our major stock shows,
you know.

And so you're kind of like like that.

That's where like I think you kind of
almost like hedge a little and can like

think about like okay,
well that one like hits me hard.

And going back to what you talked
about, like,

okay, that's the one that hits me hard.

Well, let's say, you know, you know,
San Antonio just announced there is like,

does that hit
Jason Simpson and Jake haunches hard.

You know, that's maybe when that checklist
really starts like I know he hits me.

I know if I'm judging, like grand champion
honors.

Let's get out of here.

But does it hit those guys?

You know, that's probably where, like,

that checklist can become more
and more of like.

Well, we're not chilling
at the County Road De and Knowlton, Texas.

Jackpot.

We should have a jackpot there.

Be fun. Set up like a tent.

We never get started.

You'd be late to your own jackpot.

Well, so. Okay. Price pressure,

this budget.

Obviously. I think that kind of answers
itself, right?

This budget change the decision
or does the price change the decision?

And I think it does. Right.

I think it does with everybody and I don't
I don't care if your disposable income

is, you know, astronomical or, you know,
even if you're, you know,

a swing for the fence guy,
like budget is still real, right?

Like, I mean, we're all, if we want to be
honest, spending more than we should.

And, you know, these things obviously cost
a lot of money.

And, you know,

families are doing

everything in their power to try to,
you know, by the best ones they have and,

you know, have the nice stuff at home
and the nice trailer, like,

I mean, let's,
you know, real world, real world stuff.

So, yeah, I mean, budgets
are always going to be a deal

that that is going to drive people
in some capacity.

You know,
we're having a live sale tomorrow.

There could be, you know, a guy

that walks in that thinks that no matter
what, he's buying one of those lots.

And then if again, those two fools link
up, like at some point,

you know, he might be like, well,
he wants it worse than I do.

And that all goes back into,

you know, their budget or what
they're willing to sacrifice or whatever.

Probably what
I'm fixing to get into tomorrow night.

Yeah.

No, you got to be that guy

that just bows up, looks across the table
and says, let's get it on.

Yeah. Yes, that's what I love to hear.

I love to hear that.

But I also think I also think that, like,
we have to remember

like and I, and I kind of always
keep this in the back of my mind

and like I use it as a little bit of like,
you know, maybe a little motivation.

Like there's always going to be somebody
that can spend more than you.

This is a feeders game.

Like if you buy that one though,
that's like, maybe he's not perfect.

Maybe he's not exactly,
you know, the high seller.

But like, hey, that one fits my barn.

That one fits my kid.

That one fits the guy that I'm going to
because I did my homework.

And I know that lot two is better than lot
one for this particular show.

And even though so-and-so bought lot one
and that was the one to buy that day

because he did look,
you know, maybe the best

and maybe even the one that I liked
the best that a lot to like,

if I'll do my homework
and I'll, I'll go home

and we'll, we'll take care of that thing
we were supposed to and we'll feed

and exercise and, you know, all the stuff,
and we'll get him out and jackpot him.

And, you know, give that sheep the best
opportunity that genetically is possible.

Like it's a feeders game.
Like use it as a challenge.

Like go beat that guy.

Absolutely.

That's
that's funny to me than just going out

and buying the high dollar one and keeping
even the high dollar one and

and winning with him.

Not not saying
that winning is not fun at at any level,

but it's fun to go out there
and find that one that's,

you know, 2500 bucks or whatever
he was, and feed on him and win with him.

Well, and that's how you know, like
I and obviously I'll reference Papa.

Hey, you know, in this deal I mean like
he was always and you know, I grew up with

a, you know, parents that were education
school teachers, like, so we didn't.

And maybe,
maybe dad was a little smarter than I am.

Like, he would pump, pump the brakes.

Sometimes whenever
I just try to swing for the fence.

But like, it was like,
you know, going to bro six back in the day

and, you know,
like I referenced it, you know,

in one of those first couple episodes,
like the sheep that I went in Dallas with,

he literally came home and like,

he had like four joints
that needed to be taken off his tail.

I mean, like,
and I think that she brought $1,100,

you know, and but like, you know,
kind of got to be creative.

You got to have imagination.
You got to know, hey.

And he was fat.

Pray found him over stuck in the corner
of, you know, the feed trough knowing him.

And, you know, nobody else saw him,
but like.

Yeah. And then, you know,
he took him home.

He did a tail job on him.

We tracked him and,

you know, like, all of a sudden
he's like, hey, we might have something.

So I think just because like,
and you know,

you see it all the time and I get it
and it can be frustrating.

I'm, you know, we're candid and we,
you know, talk about things openly.

Like, I really, really wanted to buy that
sheep that sold at Blue Bloods last year.

And you know, that one ends up
winning Fort Worth.

And I can't repeat on camera
what Graham said.

Yeah.

I mean, so, like, you know,

like we all there's always somebody
that might, you know, outbid you.

And so you just kind of got to go home
and like, hey, I'm, I'm, I'm

pretty decent at this.

Like I'm going to try hard
and we're gonna,

we're gonna see what happens,
maybe beat em, maybe you don't.

Maybe your third. But like.

That Blue Bloods
final cross panned out pretty good.

Yeah, yeah.

If you're into red ribbons.

So give me give me three questions.

Gut check questions before you, before
you commit, before you commit and say,

yep, I'm going to take him home.

I would say the first one,
you know, kind of goes back to that.

Does he fit the judge?

I think you have to be very aware of that
situation.

Does he fit what I'm doing this year?
Yeah.

Yeah yeah. Does he fit?
Does he fit? You fit.

Does he fair a program? Let's say that.
Because I don't want him to think that.

Like you need to go and buy a sheet.
For sure.

Great point. Yeah.

Great point.

No. Does he fit our program?

Does he fit our program? And that can be.

Does he fit our house?
Does he fit our kids?

Does he fit the shows that we're going to.

And that can be as much as age wise.

You know, like see some of these guys
that will call, you know,

and hey, I saw that you're having your,
you know, your fall born sale.

And it's like the first part of December.

Like I wanted to ask you about lot one.
All right. Yeah. Cool.

Look real good sheet, blah blah blah.

Tell him he's bread. All right.
We got a county show next April.

Do you think he'll work for that?

No, he will not.

You know, like so does.

So, you know,
that would definitely have to be on one.

Does he fit the program?

You know, program at home.

Kids showing ability.

You know,

and then maybe what show he's going to
and obviously that kind of, you know, kind

of comes in there and falls in line
with, with with the judge's perspective.

I know that this is probably definitely
not something you're going to agree with.

If we had if we had your wife on here,
she could she could back me on this.

But like I like to know how their bread.

I'm, I'm very.

I think you maybe you're taking this
a little too far.

I'm very

aware of how some of those things feed

that we have had some success with,
and there's some consistency there.

And so I just kind of always

and like we're having to buy these things
as 60, 70, 90 day old babies.

Like we're trying to project out
at the end of the day,

like, doesn't it sound crazy?

You just gave 5000 for a 75 day
old baby lamb or goat,

and you're trying to project out
how he's going to grow 12 months from now.

If people were not involved in our game,
they would say, we all are stupid.

Whole other podcast about this
knowing the breeding behind the weather

that you're fixing to buy. Yeah,
but I just.

Think it's rate of genetics is so fast
nowadays

in in bucks nowadays or year one.

And then done or whatever.

It's like well how do we how do we know
now it's not saying that I don't ask.

I still ask how they're bred every time,
but I think I look at it

more of the second generation
and the third generation.

That's what I take into account
more, right?

Because that's where we're going to start
getting our predictability like,

oh, absolutely.

You know, a first year.

But yeah, we really don't know
how those are going to feed or do.

But is he, you know,
is he a chief unicorn?

Yeah. Did his dad do something.
Yeah I see the yeah.

Well something and we know
that there's some predictability.

And I think the, I think the,
probably the thing that I like to keep up

with, books are always
the first thing you hear, right?

Somebody says, hey, how's that one bread.

You know,
that's always what they're going to say.

I like to try to keep up with what
some of those females have done.

You know,
we probably fall into a little bit

of a small circle
there in terms of where we buy sheep.

I don't know,
you might disagree with that.

But, you know, like
we've had some of those youths

that have raised some of those sheet
that we've been successful with.

So the next year when I go to, you know,
to that place or the next year on the,

you know, the ones at the house,
I want to be like, okay, hey.

She raised that one last year
and that's how he fed.

That's what he did.

Now, I know this one's out

of a different book, whatever,
but it's just something to kind of like.

I just feel like.

I feel like it's something
you can kind of add to that checklist.

Like you're kind of in there.

You're
you're making those decisions and like,

so that's that's probably the thing
that I would kind of land on second.

So you know does does that one,
does that one fit our program.

Does he kind of check all of those things.

And then and then you know I like to
I like to, you know,

kind of know
a little bit of genetic background

and kind of where those things,
where those things

kind of kind of land
from that perspective.

And then I think the last thing
and it can sometimes be hard because,

you know, we might be, you know,
traveling solo or, you know, if you're

have ran around with me very much,
you know, maybe I do stuff late at night.

I love

if one of my kids is there to have them
set them up, because I think that kind of

goes back to what you were talking, you
know, like, does he look good on that one?

Does Joe look good on that one?

You know,

just kind of that last little final like,
hey y'all, grab that thing, set him up.

You know, just kind of that like,

does it look like it could all blend
when they're a year down the road?

Like, that's always something that we try
to like, try to do and also like,

you know, like
breeders are used to showing those sheeps.

So like, let's be honest, like they're,

you know,
they might be able to hide a few flaws,

you know, they got so like
put the kids on them and just see like,

hey, does everything look like I did
right before I, you know, sign this check.

I did that.

I mean, while you were at the hair
salon, I.

Was barber. I go to a barber,
I don't go to a hair salon.

Like getting curls.

As long as you took there,
I thought maybe you were getting

your nails done or something.

I was looking at your set down there,

and the one that I wanted to look at,
I had I had Chet get on him.

I said, hey, get on that sheet,
set him up, sets him up.

I told Graham, grandma, stand there.

She has four foot, nine grand, six foot.

Graham, get on that sheet.

You know, I wanted to see the difference.

I just did that. Like what?

How does that sheet match up? Right. Yeah.

Yeah yeah. Great point.

Yeah.

Those are kind of the three that I guess,

you know, right there before we,
we kind of, you know, file them in.

So last thing
before we close out this episode,

you know, if we're picking
multiple animals for Texas majors

for, for multiple kids, right.

Like,
we've got to pick from multiple kids.

I've got two kids.

My own multiple breeds. Multiple breeds.

We help a bunch of people.

We've got a fine sheep for those people.

What's our what's your strategy there?

I wonder how different it is
from Australia.

I think mine is probably gether.

I always say I'm a hunter gatherer,
like I'm going to drive around, run

around, beat the bushes,
and I'm just going to gather up

as many good ones
as I can possibly afford.

You know,

going through that checklist,

going through all the things
that we've talked about on this episode,

like good ones are good ones,
you know, we've got five, six,

seven options, you know, as far as,
you know, from Dallas to, to Austin,

you know, on where ones
that might be different can fit.

So we're going to gather up
is just many good ones as we can.

And you know,
both of us are in similar situations

where we've got some families
that rely on us,

you know,
you know, help them in those selections

and in that, in that hunter
and hunting and gathering process.

And so that's kind of my deal is like
there's always going to be different

budgets.

Sheep are going to cost difference,
you know,

like whether it's finals and crosses,
whatever that looks like.

And so it's kind of
just one of those deals.

I mean, I've obviously been to your place
and you know, as many,

you know, finals and crosses we've bought
and traded over the years from like

you guys like sometimes I buy 4 or 5
of the real expensive, real good ones.

And then sometimes I'm like, hey, man,
I got a couple of real young families.

But like, our budgets not quite there yet.

Like, you know, a little imagination.
Show me them.

Show me that skinny pen.

Like, let's get in there
and let's dig around and let's do some,

let's do some,
let's do some livestock sorting,

you know,

and just see if there's not something
in there that we can find that looks like,

hey, in 60 days and 90 days like that
one's going to make one.

And so that's kind of
my philosophy is like,

we're going to try to gather up
as many as we can.

I always tell the kids, don't name them
till validation because it may change.

And like that one, I mean, we've had it
before, like taking a sheep to a jackpot

wins the jackpot.

And Monday he's gone. Yeah.

You know, and you were talking about that

I thought about

when you're talking about in the big ring
and seeing what they look like.

You know, last year we had a, we had a
weather that we took to a jackpot weekend.

We were there just donkey stomps at all
for all four rings.

Right.

And I'm thinking,
man, I got I got one here, you know,

go to

Kansas City,
get him in a big ring on a big stage.

And I sit there and go, he's not good
enough, right?

He was good enough at that little jackpot
in that little ring

in the middle of the summer.

But yeah, it's not.

And I mean, I think that's the thing

that, like, people
can't beat theirself up about.

And I mean like even, you know, guys.

I mean he was a bad cheap. Absolutely.

Yeah.

But we're talking about sorting hairs,
you know, cutting fine hairs here.

And, you know,

you would have went through all of that
checklist that we talked about.

You would

you would have tied
into all the big things that sheep

would have probably had majority
of the bells and whistles.

And then sometimes you get there
and you're like, hey, that's a nice one.

That one's not good enough
to maybe do what we're trying to do.

And it's just part of it. Like,
you guys have had success.

We've been fortunate to have success on
on, you know, the big stage and like it's

just part of it.

Like again,
we're trying to project these things out,

you know, and like you're hoping
that everything goes in line

and everything works,
whether it's, you know, sheep, goats,

I mean, you know,

obviously any of the species,
but like just part of it,

sometimes you get them out there
and if you're objective

and you don't just go back
and kick the bucket and say,

that damn judge has no idea
what he's doing.

No, man.

That sheep, he's. Just.

He's wasn't good enough. Like, it's
part of it.

We've all been there.

I've.
I have my sheep. Shear loves to come.

You know about February.

And there is no telling the dollar
amount of sheep that he will take to

harvest and butcher.

Always tell him, like, hey, bud,
that's prime lamb.

Like that stuff.

He's like, why don't you buy that one?

I'm like, I'm not real sure right now.

I don't know why I did that.

So yeah.

So I mean that's a, that's kind of my,
that's that's my deal.

Does that very for
you are you. Yeah. No no I don't.

Maybe a little bit
I think, you know when you're buying a

we're going to go out
and try to buy the best ones.

We can write and put those together.

And then for me to there
I think, you know, budget

seems to sort a lot of that out.

How do how do we get these
into all these different homes

and make sure that all these different
families and kids are successful?

And it's not like I pick and choose and
I have a favorite or anything like that.

I think budget just,
just naturally kind of.

Dictates some of that. Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.

No, I would agree I would agree okay.

All right.
So I think we're kind of wrapped up.

All right.

So I hope that I've got something down
there that checks some of those boxes.

I can't wait till tomorrow night.

Whenever you're like you're probably going
to be on the front row I bet bidding I.

Know I may just stay at the hotel
and bid online or something.

Golly, I'm gonna tell everybody.

Hey, y'all watch it.

If Sam's bidding,
that thing checks all the boxes, okay?

And you need
you need to. You need to bid on that one.

Too bad the sales aren't going to happen
when this, but.

I know, I know.

So that's kind of a wrap on episode three.

You know, we talked about obviously
walking in the pen,

you know, the things that hit us hard,
the things that, you know, we can't,

can't accept not being,
you know, very, very good.

The things that,

you know, maybe we kind of
want to make some of those decisions

or make some of those tough decisions
and those close calls on,

I think whenever we talk about,
you know, after we've made that selection,

you know, I kind of talked about
a lot ago, like we signed that check.

We're loading
in the loading in the trailer.

We're taking them home.

So next time
we'll hit on what that looks like.

Going home
with that animal shot, halter breaking,

getting them to

eat, keeping them on feed,
keeping them healthy.

That's what
the next episode is going to be about.

Yeah, I'm going to
I feel like I feel like this one so far.

And I think a lot of our listeners
and our guests will probably agree, like,

I think the first three episodes
of Drench Line,

everybody knowing us in our buddies
and our friends

and our customers are probably like, hey,
that was really informative.

At some point, when are them guys
going to really get into it?

I think that's next time. Yeah.

Different, different.

Different mindsets,
different feeds, different approaches.

Time to start ruffling some feathers.

I can't wait.

All right.
So we do have a couple of questions.

Or I guess we got a little handful
of them here that we had folks submitted.

So again you know if you got any questions
as you, you know listen

drop us a line on com.

You can submit them.

And as we kind of work
through these episodes,

we will hopefully try to answer them
the best of our ability

or kind of what we feel like,
you know, work for us.

I'm not going to sit here and tell you

that it's the perfect answer to
maybe where you live or what.

You know, the things that you've got.

All we can do is talk about what
we've seen, what we've done,

kind of what works for us.

So yeah, as we kind of answer
through some of these questions, again,

drop us a line.

If you got any

thoughts, questions concerns
submit something.

I'm not going to tell you that it's
the perfect answer for your situation.

Or we can talk about.

Things on the table.

Anything is on the table. Like,

What?

Sam beard oil he uses.

Oh, okay.

Yeah.

All we can talk about some things
that that we have that we've seen that

we've done in our trials
and probably mostly errors.

So, Samantha, Samantha hit us with,
do you feed hay?

And if so.

And so we're going to we're going to make
that a two segment question because

and again I know what we'll probably talk
about this throughout the you know the

this these sessions we probably land
a little more sheep friendly

because that is both of, you know,
maybe our passions a little bit more.

And then, you know,
we've all got our goat buddies that,

you know, just continue
to enforce our hand on that.

So we'll kind of talk about that
on the sheep side and the goat side,

because I do think that kind of varies.
Yeah.

So you and I talked about this other day,

just maybe in person or on the phone.

I do not feed alfalfa.

I feed a grassy,

I feed a grass.

Every evening we feed Tifton 85.

That's what we have in round bells
that we feed our use.

It's a fertilized, irrigated Tipton 85.

It's a great grassy.

And if you do the research on Tipton,
it's kind of.

And I'm not saying that's the one
you need to feed, but let's just say, you

know, coastal Tifton,
something of that coastal Bermuda.

I feed grass

because I just want to keep their guts
working there, a ruminant animal.

They have to have that in their
gut to keep it working.

They have to have some stem in there.

And the reason for that is, is
I don't want to change

the protein content
in their diet that much.

I just
want something to keep that gut going.

And I know that the feed and supplements

I'm using are doing
what they're supposed to do.

My grass aids keeping the gut work
and keeping things functioning properly

and not shit them out. Yep.

Agreed to a certain point.

Agree to disagree slightly,
but yeah, I would.

I would agree with most of it.
Tell me this.

Okay.

Again,
you know, two part question show goats.

Yeah, yeah.

I still feed grass to my goats to

I don't I don't offer them,
you know much alfalfa, but.

Do you chop it up
like the professionals do?

I do not chop it
up. You're not a professional.

He's not a guys. He's not a professional.

Goat herder.

Yeah. Okay.

Yeah, I would agree.

The only thing that we do feed alfalfa,
we've always fed alfalfa.

I'm a big believer in alfalfa.

And, you know,

that is probably a I'm sure that someone
will have some opinion on that.

And quite frankly, I don't care
because I know what's worked for us.

We don't feed what let's call
horse quality.

Number one, all the leaves
we feed, we feed striped rained on.

Yeah, cheap stuff.
Like I called my guy down the road.

I'm like, hey, you got any that stuff

that's been rained on like three times
and you've raked it twice

and you know, it's
got a little stem to it.

To me, that's, that's
that's the kind of outfall for that.

We feed
and we feed it along with, with grass.

So what we try to do.

Early on is we feed a little heavier
alfalfa while they're growing

as that growing, you know, curve.

You know, as

we work through the year, always call it,
we kind of let that pendulum shift.

We start off like 75% alfalfa, 25% grass,

and then we kind of flip it
as the year goes on.

So but again, ruminant animals,

some of that, you know,

steamy alfalfa grass that'll get in there
and scratch things up,

keep things rolling, keep things active,
microbial development and all that.

Without question. Goats.

I'm probably going to get in trouble

because of the guys that like to sell me
goats.

I don't know, probably not.

They're probably

laughing at us right now, but they
they aren't big on the hay deal.

We still feed. Hey,
they're still ruminants.

We need to they.

I feel like they eat better.

I have chopped it up a couple of times,
so maybe I'm.

I don't know yet.

Like little scissors
and. Chop it up. Hoof nippers.

Yeah,

I think it's maybe just kind of what I try
to do to maybe get out of whatever

we're finishing the day with.

I'll just be like,
all right, I gotta chop the goats hay.

Well,
everybody else is like, still raking pins.

Mix a cocktail and chop up. Yeah, exactly.

Yep. All right.
Thanks, Samantha. Hopefully, maybe.

Kind of answered answer.

Kind of what we do
and what we found some success with.

Chance.

Chance?

First time stock show dad here.

Should I share my daughter
sheep with a surgical blade?

The breed is a south down.

Oh, man, that's
a very good question, chance.

And you know, God bless you
for being the first time.

Show dad going through all this.

You know, that's a that is a really
that's a really good question.

I think it's a loaded question too,
because when we talk about off breeds.

Right.

We have got to talk about hide quality.

Sure.

Big deal.

I think if you know that
that Southdown is really good hide it.

He's tight.

Hide it. And what I would
call has a little belly wool on him.

Some of those swirls in there.

I think

you're totally fine with sharing him
with the surgical for a major stock show.

If you were going to go to just a jackpot
sharing with Bines,

you're going to be fine.

But if we're going to go to somewhere
like Houston

and we have to shear on a Monday
and we're not showing until a Wednesday,

then you probably need
to go with some surgical.

That's going to be my
answer. Yeah, I would agree.

What do you do on the on your jackpot
cheap during the summer.

Is that very.

No. We typically always share those.

Well, it'll change a little bit.

Depends on if I really want to go,
like, knock somebody's head off or not.

Like whenever you call and say,
hey, are you going to that show?

And then all of a sudden know that, like,
oh, dude, Sam's got loaded.

Yeah. We'll text each other.

Like I was just going to share with fines
and roll in there and, you know, be fine.

He'll start drenching like, on Tuesday.
Yeah.

Find out Logan's coming.

I'm like,
I'm gonna change my little outlook here.

Typically
we'll share with finds at a jackpot

because I want to give them a little extra
protection from, like, fungus, stuff

like that.

I want to strip them down as hard,
and you can shear on a Friday.

You're going to show on a Saturday, right?

Good, good. Sharp pair of fines.

I think you're fine with jackpots there.

Yeah, that's that's the same philosophy
we have.

We'll do fines all during the summer.

Kind of maybe help with, you know, combat
that fungus deal just a little bit. And,

Yeah,

I think that that's
a I think that's a great question, chance.

I think make sure that that animal skin
quality is good enough for surgical.

Right.

And maybe
even like a new pair of surgical,

like we've all got those
that have kind of been floating around

you've had for like ten years

and they've been sharpened like 97 times
and you're like.

Well.

That's that's what that dude did me today
when he was lining me up.

I bet those were some like, yeah,
some old surgical he had in the back.

Yeah. Okay. Chance. Good luck.

I hope you get to continue being a stock
show.

Dad. Don't get frustrated, buddy.

Ask more questions
if you use chance. Yeah, Mark.

All right.

Mark said I see people.

Oh, dude, this is going to be good.

I see people with chain halters
and rope halters.

Do you have a preference?

Can we get some music on this right now?

Is this where you're like.

So the the

the joke is amongst us is that, you know,
we're making fun of somebody.

We'll call them the,
you know, those rope, halter shoulders.

Rope altar crew.
Yeah. That rope halter crew.

God, we're going to get so much trouble
for this one.

Some of our old West Texas
buddies are probably going to hear this

and be super mad at us.

Yeah, I am not a fan of rope halters.

We're chain halter people.

If anybody knows, we were the ones
that kind of started the West draw.

Yeah, yeah,
I actually sometimes forget about that.

So we kind of started that whole,
you know, wipe down

chain halters that keep the fungus off
and all that stuff.

But, yeah, big chain halters.

And I think the biggest for me
is when you're teaching, though,

I think they're safer.

I really do,

because if we clip on to the fence
or we walk away,

if they set back
or fall down or something like that,

and they get up as soon as they get up
and leave that pressure.

That chain. Yeah. Kind of releases.

In those rope halters.

Yeah.
We're going to suck down on the nose.

And I've seen some sheep and goats
killed with those.

Yeah, absolutely.

That's a that's a good
I mean that's obviously definitely

something that, you know, you can tell

I always forget that y'all started
I don't know why.

Just that seems like ages ago.

Yeah.

But you obviously put some Jerry
must have put some thoughts into that

on you actually probably did
kill a really, really expensive one.

And you're like,
hey, we got to change this.

Yeah.

Yeah.
So that's that's kind of where we're at.

But I agree 100%.

And I think those animals just respond
better, you know, like

when you're trying to halter break them,
like give them a little tension there.

That rope halter just kind of pulls tight.

I think you said something that, you know,
maybe we don't think about as much,

but that wiped down ability to disinfect,
keep those things sanitary.

Going from show to show. Like that's huge.

Yeah. Yeah.

That's a.

And I'm going to I'm
going to go back to the golf thing.

Right. Like

you know getting back into this
I'm going to play terrible.

But by God I'm going to look.

You're going to look good. Absolutely.

You know that's something.

And like you can get
all those different colors like,

we can, you know, give,
give our buddy Tyson a plug there.

I mean, like,
those guys have real supplements.

Every kind of color probably combo.

You've probably got some customized ones.

What if I'm going to have a bad lamb
there?

I'm going to have a cover on him

on, have his legs wrapped
and I'm a nice halter on him.

When I walk out of the scale,
I'm not somebody think.

Cool, everybody's going to be like, dude,
I bet that kid's got a good one.

And and then all of a sudden you, like,
walk in there like, oh, not so much.

But you look great, man. Look great.

I bet that's there's no telling
how much you spent on your golf attire.

I mean, I know that I know
your your new clubs, but your golf attire.

No, I found this this shirt
I have on this golf shirt.

I have one today
that was on sale at Sam's Club.

Oh, yeah. We also learned this about Sam.

He does some of his wardrobe
shopping at Sam's Club.

I didn't actually know that that was
as big of a thing as apparently it is.

So that's not much different than Hibbett
Sports and.

Hip it. Sports is awesome.

I'll have some. Good deals.

Hibbett sports yeah,
they're going to probably they're gonna

they're going to sponsor us at some point
because all of our sneakers

come from there.

That's that kind of wraps up
episode three.

I know this one, you know,

probably gets a little more in line with
maybe where we're going to be linked wise.

I'm sure by the time you know, it
gets, you know,

cut down or whatever, it's,
you know, kind of shoot for,

you know,

maybe that a little longer than

maybe those first episodes or whatever,
but hopefully you guys maybe found

some information
or some or some subtle humor.

One of the two.

And yeah, if you get any questions
that you would like to submit to us again,

you know,
drop us a line, head over to line

and you can submit those questions.

Hit follow.

Leave a review if you're on Apple, out
at silvers, livestock.

Silvers, Livestock News and livestock.

Both of us got, you know,
handful of sales and stuff coming up.

I know we're both the same.

Like I feel like this is like,
you know, we talked about it.

We're like in the thralls of all of it.

Like, it feels like it's
just 90 to nothing right now.

Selling, buying, selling bond.

But like, we both sell sheep up until.

October 31st. Yeah. Yeah.

That's always tell people like,
when do you sell sheep.

Well,
we don't sell in November and December,

and the rest of the time
we are probably selling.

So give us a shout.
We'd love to help you out.

Hopefully, maybe

we can help you achieve
whatever that goal is it looks like. But.

Yeah.

Thanks for thanks for listening.

Like Sam said, follow us.

Leave a review.

As long as we're positive.
See you next time.

Thanks, guys.